Business as Usual Featuring Gerardo Interiano at Aurora
Today's webcast is a must-see, as we welcome Gerardo Interiano, Head of Government Relations at Aurora, to update us on its latest progress in autonomous vehicle technology and the company's commitment to supporting the local community. Gerardo and Aurora helped spearhead the Beyond the Laptops initiative back in April to raise funds and awareness for Pittsburgh Public School students in need of laptops. Find out how Aurora has been developing leading-edge tech and giving back to the community in this call!
Everybody, welcome to business as usual, Happy Friday. So glad to have you here. This is Jonathan kersting from the Pittsburgh tech Council. I'm filling in for Audrey Russo today. And we got a terrific show in front of us with Gerardo Interiano from Aurora. Very exciting to have him on the show today, but lots of great questions for him. But as always, before we get to our guests, we set the ground rules, as Audrey always does. Just to remind everybody that your mics have all been muted, just we can keep the background noise. I will apologize ahead of time of my background noise because I have two dogs that like to bark their heads off at about this time every day. It's perfect timing for our show. So if you hear dog's barking, it's gonna be okay. And we got to thank our sponsors. Of course, we have awesome sponsors that make this show happen. We couldn't do it without them. Of course Huntington bank has been with us since day one. I think we're getting close to our hundredth episode. Pretty soon and
From the very beginning, Huntington have been with us. He's guys are the region's top SBA lenders as far as that goes, really glad to have him with us. And of course, we also have Deloitte hanging out with us as well to Deloitte, consultants in town cannot go wrong with these guys. And they have some awesome thought leadership on their website or on all types of things. Some recent stuff I was reading from Deloitte was around smart cities, and they're in a thing. So go there and check them out. And sheetz. love these guys here. Sheetz has been on the technology forefront forever. I think they were some of the first to actually do remote ordering to actually just go to a kiosk and order your sandwich. We all know their food is super tasty, but their tech is just as tasty as well too, because their innovation center is now happening here in Pittsburgh. So having Sheetz on board with us is super, super cool. So speaking of super cool Aurora, I do believe is super cool. And Gerardo, you are super cool. I'm so glad you're taking a video Friday to hang out with us today. And just get all things going about what's going on with Aurora because one of these companies that I just think
really putting Pittsburgh on the map. And some of the work that you guys have done recently like around our beyond the laptops initiative just blew my mind. So we have much to talk about today. Before we do that, just introduce yourself real fast Gerardo. And tell us what you're all about. And the fact that you came to Pittsburgh, from Austin, and when I can tell you're kind of digging Pittsburgh right now, huh? Yeah, no, absolutely. Jonathan, thank you for having me. Thanks for Brian and Audrey and all the incredible work that you guys do at the Technology Council. And I will apologize in advance because in addition to having a dog that barks at anything, and everything that moves outside of the windows, I also have three kids that may or may not interrupt them at some point during our call, but appreciate having me and excited to talk a little bit more about Aurora and our spirits here in Pittsburgh. But yeah, as you mentioned, we moved up to Pittsburgh about a year ago.
And in fact, we're literally coming on a year here at the end of the month. And we're loving our time here and I spent the last 20 years in Austin working in government
And in tech, and decided to join Aurora because I firmly believed in the mission that the company has and the impact that it can have. And was excited about exploring Pittsburgh and having my family have the opportunity to be here and learn a little bit more about this part of the country, but also the incredible work that's happening here with self driving technology. I'm so happy to go in depth in whatever you want and cover any subjects, that folks might be helpful. And honestly, my hope is that you guys will have some some questions for me, I hope that this is much more of an interactive conversation and that you guys don't have to listen to me talk the entire time. So I look forward to having a broader conversation. Absolutely. We have the chat up here. And I encourage everyone to put your questions in the chat. We will try to get to all the questions if at all possible. So I'll be monitoring the chat there as well or I'll bring those questions in when they come in as far as that is in. First off. We're just glad you're in Pittsburgh doing what you're doing. So welcome to Pittsburgh, and we're glad you're finding a good time here. So
Before I know you'll continue to have a great time here in Pittsburgh, and everything like that, so maybe do a little level set with a roar because I mean, Aurora, you guys, if you're more than what meets the eye, there's so much going on the types of technologies that you're developing. It's more than just self driving cars. It's it's all about transportation and safety. As far as that goes, you give us a quick little tour of Aurora real quick, and then we'll kind of jump into some fun stuff. Yeah, absolutely. So, you know, Aurora, we were starting in 2017. Right. So we're not that old of a company. But our three founder, two of our three founders have deep connections here in Pittsburgh. So Chris Urmson, who's our CEO, got his PhD at Carnegie Mellon spent some time here in Pittsburgh before he went out to California to start Google's self driving car project, which is now way Moe. our CTO is Drew bagno, who's still here in Pittsburgh, he still a professor at Carnegie Mellon, he's still very much engaged at the university. In fact, I believe he's still a faculty member there. And he was at Carnegie Mellon and then went on to help build
And lead Uber's ATG unit. And then our Chief Product officer Sterling Anderson, who was previously at Tesla and led Tesla's autopilot and the Model X. And he's our Chief Product officer. So, you know, we we are lucky to have three founders that have already done this before at different companies, so we get to learn from them. Right? So the mission of Aurora is to deliver the benefits of self driving technology safely, quickly, broadly. And there's four key words that we focus there. Number one, it's it's about delivering the benefits, right? Like, we don't want to be just another tech company for the sake of building a tech company. But what we're passionate about is the fact that we believe that this technology is truly transformative. And as you mentioned, it's not just about building a self driving car, but it's the impact that that technology is going to have. So the three adverbs are safely quickly broadly. For us, safety has to be paramount, right like, we will have failed if we do not make our roads safer if we did not make the experience of drivers safer.
If we don't make it safer for kids to cross the street if we don't make it safer for the movement of goods and the movement of people to happen across all the different systems, and then quickly, because every year in the United States 40,000 Americans lose their lives, right. And we believe that anything worth doing is worth doing quickly. And so for us, it's about having the focus, to be able to focus on that mission and try to bring about this technology as quickly as possible because we believe that it will literally save people's lives. And then the one that I get the most passionate about is Broadway. And this is where we get a little bit more into the intricacies of the company. So for us broadly means two things. Number one, we're a platform agnostic company. So we're not just about putting our technology on a on a single platform. So for example, the product that we are learning that we are building is the Aurora driver. And that is the hardware, the software or the cloud services that can be deployed across a variety of different platforms and make that a self driving self driving vehicle.
So whether it is a an eagle and MKZ, a minivan and SUV, a bus, a shuttle, a commercial vehicle or class eight truck, we are truly agnostic as far as how that technology gets deployed, but what we believe is that our system will benefit from having those data inputs that come from all those different platforms. The other thing that broadly means to us is that we don't want this technology to just be accessible by for you, right? Like, we want this technology to be accessible by many across the community. So the way that I think about it, and the way that we think about it as a company is we want a senior citizen who loses their mobility, to be able to have this technology to get that back. We want somebody that has a disability that relies on family and friends, to get them to work, to be able to have that freedom and the ability to take a job without thinking about how am I going to get there every single time. And then we also think about you know, the single parent who has to worry about how do I get to work
takes time away from their kids, because they have to take three different bus routes to get to their job. If we can bring give that time back to those families, that's a huge impact of their lives. So for us, it truly is about the entire ecosystem. And it's about the movement of people in the movement of goods. So as you may have, as some of you may have hopefully seen, Aurora announced last year that we were going to be getting more into classic trucking. Right. And so that's, that's a huge component. We were talking, in fact, with a state senator earlier this year, who's a dairy farmer. And he was talking about how this technology will literally open up markets to dairy farmers here in Pennsylvania that right now, they just can't get to because of the hours of service and the limitations of having a human driver behind the wheel. So the impact is very real. And I think it's part of what what excites us is that we can see this happen across all of these different platforms. I'm glad you brought that up. First of all, I'm glad you gave that explanation of a roar because like I said, I always see it as just as I say, just see it as
self driving cars you see your car going through Pittsburgh, like that's what they're doing. But it's like, no, there's so much more to it. I think you did a great job of showing our audience here that you guys are deep tentacles across and broad, as you said. Which brings us to our first question from Julia from the business times which talking about autonomous trucking and other types of why was why was that a priority now to to move there? You made headlines that earlier this week? Yeah, no, I think a big part of the big part of the opportunity that was there for us is when we acquired the LIDAR company in Bozeman, Montana. So we believe that trucking is one a huge opportunity. And we've we've always said, right, that this is not just about the movement of people, but it's about the entire transportation ecosystem. So whether it's, you know, a fleet management company, a logistics company, a ride hailing company for us, we believe that our expertise is on developing the driver. We're going to look and identify partners and rely on other organizations that have developed expertise over time.
Some hundred 100 years, right? Like you think about automobile manufacturers, right? Aurora is not building a car. But we are going to partner and rely on the OEMs, the auto manufacturers that have been doing this and that are best in class at what they do. And likewise, you can find similar partners across all of the different modes of transportation and the way that transportation intersects our world. For us, the LIDAR company that we acquired last year is a big part of the component of getting us out on the roads when it comes to trucking, right like this technology allows us to see further and to get that information faster for us to be able to feel safe driving on the highways, right? Like it some some folks will say like highway driving is easier. But the reality is, you know, it's there's a higher risk when you're driving at those speeds. So for us to be able to see an object at 300 meters, and to be able to identify is that object moving towards us or away from us and what's the velocity of that of that object is a is a new data that we can get out.
As a result of this lighter company that we acquired, that made us feel comfortable to go ahead and get into trucking, and we believe that the value is there as well. Very cool stuff. The questions are pouring in. I love it. We're getting our audience participation. It's on fire right now. And I see. So from Eric Sanchez, I'm just may not be quite at your alley, but you might have some insight on this router to tell me he wants to know about batteries be reusable, what is the lifespan of a battery? And how are they being disposed? That's something that Aurora deals with that just more than the electric car side of things would probably be a different question for an auto manufacturer. Right. Like for us, again, because we're platform agnostic? I don't know getting into that. We certainly think about it from the perspective of how do we power the systems in these vehicles? Definitely. For us, it's about putting the driver on that electric vehicle. And I think that's probably that's probably a question that an electric vehicle manufacturer would be able to better answer than I would. I would agree. I would agree. Let's jump to our next question here. This is a really good one from from the john here. He says, I've heard there is a resurgence of interest in personal vehicles due to the current
Anxiety regarding ride sharing through the fear of germs obviously, in the whole COVID thing. The cost of the systems involved in self driving vehicles is very hot, however, which would indicate it would make a sense, sensing in ride sharing scenarios in buses and trucking. What are your comments on that idea?
And I was a little distracted because my dog was getting barking their heads outside let me get
to the cost of the systems involved in self driving vehicles is very high. However, would you indicate they make more sense in ride sharing type scenario? So the idea that it costs a lot to put them into cars, people can share so the cost comes down to people sharing those whose Yeah, okay, I think we would begin by questioning the assumption that everybody will have their own vehicle come, you know, 10 2030 years from now, right. Insurance actually did a really interesting study a couple years ago, might have been 2018, I want to say, and what they found was that if you take if you incorporate self driving into a ride sharing model, right where you may be owning
a share of a vehicle or you own a part of a fleet of vehicles, but you incorporate the cost savings affiliated with self driving technology, the average family of four in the United States would save equal to seven months worth of groceries. Wow. And that's a huge impact. And you start to you start to extrapolate that and you start to think about the different economics of distributing some of those costs across multiple families and not having one individual have to take on all of that cost. And the same can be said, as you start to think about it. How does it apply to trucking, right? It's not that it's a one to one system. And so once you start to think about the cost savings when it's a shared cost, they're actually pretty significant. Interesting. We've got one more question here, too. There's been a big hype behind automated cars in the past five years, but regulatory obstacles are difficult to overcome. Are you confident automated trucks will come quicker to the market owing to easier technical challenges.
Whoo. So this is this is right up my alley, right? So, so yes and no, right? Like it depends. So much of this is regulated by so many different levels of government, right. And it's why we believe as a company like if you think about tech in general, I think this is a great audience to have this conversation. One of my biggest frustrations with the tech technology community as a whole This is a massive overgeneralization is that Tech's attitude towards government tends to be stay out of my way, I don't want you guys involved in my stuff, let me innovate. And I don't want government involved in what I'm doing every day. The problem is, at some point, something's going to happen. And you're going to want to have those relationships with government. So for us at Aurora, right, like we're a 500 person company yet we have almost Well, right now our team of government affairs team is for us, right? So we are engaging in building those relationships with government because we don't want to we don't want government to come to us when they need something. We want to open up those doors can have those relationships in place. So to answer the question more directly, you know, there are some people
pointers that are that are overseen by the federal government, some that are state and local and some and some that I'm sorry, some that are state and some that are local.
At the federal government, we're working with FMCSA and nitsa, to try to figure out exactly what all those issues are. And then it's a state by state issue, some states will allow you to do, you know, level four trucking right now, other states are going to say, No, you can only do level two trucking. And then it also comes down to what are the capabilities of the companies that are doing this work. For us, we believe it is our responsibility to go and prove to government that we are safer than a human driver. And it's not just about working with government on that it's also about working with the public, right? Like we have to go out and show and prove our business case and our safety case, that we believe that our technology safer than a human driver. And we firmly believe that as an industry, that is our responsibility. So it is important for us to go out and work with all of these different government agencies to ensure that we can deploy this stuff
technology in a way that is safe, and that it's going to have that positive impact that we believe it will have in communities. Very cool. Which leads me to my next question. And we don't see a lot of tech companies interacting with their elected officials and with government. It's something that they seem to stray away from, as you said, like we just want to innovate and move forward. But it seems like in this day and age, you really need to have a Geraldo on your team, in order to be doing that interfacing as far as it's better than me. But
yeah, I mean, it's, I think it's really important, right? It's really important to think about Communications and Public Affairs. And, you know, the way that I've always thought about government affairs is that it's part of your risk management portfolio. Right, just as much as almost every single one of your companies has some level of insurance, right like that. Having a government affairs team is your insurance against government and against things that are going to pop up in the public. They you just want somebody to have and to know where to go and where to address it. And sometimes
By having those relationships in place, and by building the trust and rebuilding the goodwill ahead of time, you're going to get the benefit of the doubt, right? And there is no amount of value that I can put on when something goes wrong, because another, all of us at some point, something's going to happen. And it might not be our fault, right? It might be something that happened to one of our competitors or within the industry. But all scrutiny is on everybody else. You want to have those relationships in place. So that folks are going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you're you have the right intentions, and that you're doing the right thing before they call you and start asking you questions. Exactly. So So to me, the value of building those relationships now before we need something from them, is truly invaluable. And we believe that government is a key partner for everything that we do. It's why we work closely with Penn Dodd and the governor's office. It's why we have a you know, good relationship with Mayor peduto and
Karena at the Department of Transportation. Riley, we believe in building those relationships, because we want them to know that they are a key partner to us. And that we understand that we that the only way that this will succeed is if that relationship exists. And we have that overlay. Absolutely. So we've got more questions coming in from our audience here. I love the audience participation. And then this next question, actually was a question I was gonna ask you about. And it kind of details like how Aurora fits into the ecosystem here in Pittsburgh, and I'm really curious to hear how you enter this says thank you for all your important work that the firm is doing. And she wants to know, is there collaboration between your firm and other firms in the field such as like Argo and Uber and so forth? Oh, absolutely. Right. Like certainly in the public policy space, right. Like we we communicate with all of the other firms on a fairly regular basis, when it comes to how we work with the different partners that are here in the community.
And certainly from aurors perspective like we are, are in touch
Higher thesis is based on partnerships, right? So So we believe that we are stronger as an industry when we can go to pen or we can go to the mayor's office and say, Hey, we have all visited and we believe that this is the best approach that is going to be in the best interest of the community of the residents of government versus having I'm not a big fan of corporations in general, this is this has nothing to do with self driving companies. But it very much applies to question. Not a big fan of corporations using government to try to build a competitive advantage. Right. I don't believe that is good public policy. Right? Like you should go and compete in the marketplace. And you should go and compete for those customers. But don't use public policy to try to develop a policy that is going to give you an advantage from your competitors from a business perspective. So for us, that's we believe in working with Argo and Uber and active and we're, we're honestly fairly regularly talking to them to make sure that we are working together to understand
what is in the best interest of the community? what is in the best interest of our users? Because ultimately, you know, we have to earn their trust. And if we start to fight with each other over how it is that we're going to deploy, that, we're just going to continue to erode that trust and make it harder for ourselves in the long term. Very interesting. Very interesting. So our next question I love these are come from all directions. It's making this so much fun. It's like random questions for your art. So basically, there's an understanding that the current self driving systems have a hard time operating in the rain in a really hard time operating in the snow. What type of progress is being made regarding dealing with this type of precipitation that we have much of here in Pittsburgh? Yeah. So look, a lot of has to do with testing, right? Like the more that you pose, the technology to those different types of weather patterns, the better that the technology is going to get. One thing that I would say is we as a company are very firm believers that that it has to be cameras, radar and LIDAR, right like some folks in the industry are trying to
Do it with not having all three of those components. But for us, those components all play really well against each other, right? Some things may see things better in darkness, some things may see better. In the rain in the snow, some things can see it further distance. So for example, I was talking to one of our engineers recently, and radar, right, like radar does a really good job of bouncing off of metal. And you can, it can identify metal really well, but it may not always see somebody a human being in the same way, right? Um, but it can see through rain and snow really easily. Whereas LIDAR can give you a better distance. But even you know, sometimes the stream of light that comes out of LIDAR may bounce off of a snowflake and come back, which is why there's 600,000 of them that go out, right. So it's about understanding the limitations of each of each technology. But for us, it's the combination of all of those sensor and all of those data points that is what's going to make the car the safest. So from our perspective, it's really important
We have those three components. And it's why we're committed, you know, to, and it's why we bought the lighter company again, coming back to Bozeman part to it, right? Yeah. Well, and then we had LIDAR before then this is just a new type of LIDAR that gives us more accurate information when it comes to the velocity and the movement of that object, which beforehand just took us longer to get. Gotcha. Another question coming up from Scott Harshman here said you had mentioned about being platform agnostic, is your r&d looking at applications for other modes of transportation down the road besides Highway Transportation? No pun intended?
Um, I guess I would follow up a question when you mean like how like non highway right? Like, I think for us, it's about autonomous planes, maybe like ships. But yeah.
I was to be honest with you. I don't know what our engineers are thinking in that regard. I think for from our perspective, it really is about the movement of people in the movement of goods. I but but yeah,
Like we are, we are thinking about rows. And that's what the focus is at a company right now. Very cool. And the questions keep rolling in man, I love this, we're filling this whole half an hour up, and it's gonna be like we're out of here before we know it. So next question from from Nick, is a convergence of autonomy and smart highway technologies are being foreseen.
So this is a chicken in the egg problem, right? Like, yes, there are, they were talking about vehicle to infrastructure, a vehicle to vehicle, we get this conversation a lot. And the thing that we are hesitant about is we do not want to develop this technology and get to the point where we're ready to deploy dependent on something else to happen, right? So if you think about smart highways and smart streets and 5g, right, like all those things are going to be we believe are going to be helpful data points in the future, and we're certainly going to want to find ways to leverage them. But we don't want to get into a position where all of a sudden our technology is ready to be deployed. And we haven't yet been
Unable to get 5g into a community and therefore technology can't come there. So are those going to be beneficial for us in the long term? Absolutely. Do we want to build our technology towards dependent on a third party or a third application that we can't control? No. So, so I hope that answers the question. Yeah, no, that I think makes a lot of sense. Let's go to our next question, because we're running out of time here, because I'm excited to see take a drink of water. Let's get ready to go. So our next question here is, how do you see the global landscape of your industry in other countries? Are we leading the pack or some countries catching up to us or meeting and research? Potentially? I mean, look, there's definitely a race for this right. And this is something that we talk about with federal officials all the time that the United States needs to continue to maintain its its leadership in this space, but that if we are not careful, and we do not continue to allow for the deployment of this technology, there are certainly other countries that are going to try to surpass us, depending on the regulatory atmosphere.
across many other countries, some in Europe, some in Asia, right? Like they are looking to find ways to bring this technology into their communities and to allow the players that are currently designing this technology in their own countries to deploy faster and to prove, prove the impact in the in those countries. So while while I believe that the United States is still currently leading in this space, we certainly have to continue to work together to figure out how do we how do we create a path for deployment? And how do we create a path for commercialization in order to maintain that leadership position. It's not something that we can sit on our laurels and think that in 10 years, we'll still be leaders if we don't create those paths. And what I love about it is that Pittsburgh is at the tip of the spear on this and it's just so freakin cool, man. I love it. Got another question here. So I want to know, how do you anticipate consumers and transportation firms to invest in automated vehicles that mean vehicles will come at a higher cost? Will clients be willing to pay the extra cost or you will
More planning on scaling down the cost of the technology over the years. You know, it's it's probably going to be in all of the above, right? Like, it's I don't know that that anybody has figured out exactly what is going to be the one business model. And I don't know that there's going to be a single business model, right. I think auto manufacturers may have one business model, ride sharing companies may have another business model, transit organizations may have another business model, I think the advantage of having so many different modes of transportation that can adopt this technology is that you'll end up finding that there are going to be multiple different business models, as the price continues to come down, right. Like as we can build this at scale, the price of LIDAR, and the price of the technology that is necessary to make this happen will go down. But I think the business models that are going to be created to deploy the technology aren't it's not going to be just one. Right. I think there's going to be multiple options for folks to access this technology. And I think that's exactly what everybody is trying to figure out is what are the what are
have the best points of entry into the market and to better understand what are the business models that will make sense the most sense to consumers. Very cool. So my next question is coming from me. Yeah, I'm just curious. So how can we keep Pittsburgh on the leading edge? I feel like we've had such a head start in this, we have all these assets in place. And like he's like, like, like you mentioned before, around the world, people are nipping at our heels here. How do we stay ahead?
Yeah, I think, you know, I think one it's, it's being able to continue to advocate with the different stakeholders in the community about the value of self driving technology, right? Like, it's one thing for us as an industry, to go to government to go to the different stakeholders who care about this issue, and advocate on our behalf. But honestly, you all as tech leaders in the community have so much more influence and so much more power. When you go and talk about what this means for Pittsburgh, what it means for the community to be able to be that ticket.
With a spirit, Jonathan, like, you know, as you mentioned, Pittsburgh is truly leading in this space. And and it's not an exaggeration to say that governments from across the country, from cities to states to the federal government are looking at Pittsburgh and upenn.to. Understand how is it that the relationship between the city and industry in the state and industry work for the deployment of this technology? So so I think that there's an opportunity here to continue to showcase that but I think it's going to be important for for the broader community to also be pushing that narrative because it can't always come from us like it's going to, it will it will look too self serving for us to go out there and continue to talk about how we believe self driving technology is great. Of course, we believe so true. self driving technology is great. But I think by by having others do the same thing. It starts to feel like this is more of a community effort, and not just a self interested Corporation coming in and telling
Government officials, wherever you believe software and technology should be here in Pittsburgh today. Absolutely. So we got about a minute left. And we got a couple more questions we can get to these really quickly. We got to wind it down, because Audrey's always very good maintaining a sharp line here. So first question is, how's Aurora worked with traditional automakers like GM or Mac? And the other question is around you see, you're having to work with other governments like like the Canadian, the Mexican government, in order to, you know, be part of their standards and so forth. As you
look, absolutely. We have partnerships with with different auto manufacturers and we certainly expect to continue to work with them directly. We, you know, the Aurora driver is not something that we foresee where you buy it off the shelf at a store and you go and install it on a car like no, we believe in the partnership model. We will work with the auto manufacturer, to make sure that the sensors are all in the right spots on the different platforms that we work with a transit company, class eight trucks like same thing, right. So those partnerships, we certainly expect to continue and as far as working with others,
government's absolutely right any any community that we see ourselves going into And earlier this week we announced an office in Dallas Fort Worth in Texas. We're going to be working closely with the government. We're going to be building those relationships and duplicating and hopefully duplicating some of the great work that we've done here in Pittsburgh, across communities, hopefully across the world. Well heard we want you staying here in the Pittsburgh Office not going to the Dallas office. Now.
You know how hot it is in Texas right now. That is true. I'm glad to hear that. I can't thank you enough for taking time to answer all these questions today. It was truly one of our Fast and Furious issues of
business as usual. It was so much fun getting all this feedback from the audience today. I think our sponsors sheets to late night and bank making this happen. I want to remind everybody on Monday we have a really cool business as usual. We're celebrating the 30th anniversary of the Americans with Disability Act. We have some folks from Carnegie Mellon and some others coming and talking about assistive technologies and also talking about what else
needs to be done to make sure that everybody has access. So are once again, have an awesome weekend and a great Friday and thanks for being part of business as usual. You are the bank looking forward. And thanks for having us. Absolutely. Thank you everybody for taking part of your Friday and learning all about auror. with us. This is john Nickerson with the tech Council. hope everyone's Cool. Thanks, everyone.